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**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** And how many tracks was it? Two tracks? |
**Tracy Hinds:** This conference I think was three tracks. Or, well, seven tracks, but three or four rooms. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** A lot of choice. |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah. Some of the tracks are sort of like fledgling in Node; we know that they're popular in the ecosystem, but we maybe didn't see as many talks, or just trying to balance all of that out with time. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Right. Back to How To Conf, the reason why I asked you that was more or less to see if you have - since you shared that portion of your experience, and I'm sure other contributors as well - some sort of playbook that says, "This is how we did this conference right", and you care enough about the com... |
**Tracy Hinds:** Right. Yeah, that's an excellent point. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Any plans for that? |
**Tracy Hinds:** Well, there weren't plans for it yet. \[laughs\] |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Maybe it could be How To Interact for Interactive. |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah, that would be cool. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Lame name, don't listen to me. I'm bad at naming. |
**Tracy Hinds:** \[laughs\] I'm terrible at naming things, so I always take suggestions. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, what else can we talk about in terms of -- what good takeaways can we share with the audience listening to this? This is a series we're producing with the NodeJS Foundation, the Linux Foundation, sponsored by IBM, to give a picture into this conference and the future of Node... So what can you... |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah, yeah... This time next year I think it's going to be a very different conversation I'm hoping to have, because a lot of our inclusivity strategy that I've been working on has been receiving input by a bunch of different parties. It's a careful conversation that we have to have around what we want... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** How about the project itself, in terms of onboard of contributors...? Mikeal and I talked about how over the years, since the io.js fork with the merge with Node, the Foundation being formed - each year you've one hundred percent doubled the Node community, so I gotta imagine that trying to be as be... |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah, so there's been a lot of discussion around rebooting documentation in general, because we've seen a lot of slowdown on that; that could be not just documentation for the API, it could also be on "What are the values of the Node community?" Because it's grown so much, you've got folks who've been ... |
\[32:15\] There's definitely a lot of room for us to do that, and we need way more people working on it. Core is so important, but it's a very small footprint of what Node is. For instance, right now I've drafted up a charter for a new org in the Node Foundation, alongside the TSC, which would be the community org. |
So much of our success over the years has been stuff like Node school and Node bots, and the meetups that happen around the world, and the other conferences that happen. They don't need to be under the Node Foundation in terms of paperwork and governance, but they absolutely need representation, because we're doing thi... |
It doesn't sound at first like it would make sense to be a strategy in inclusivity, but all of those people around the world who have been organizing these things have been on the ground and have learned and scaled, so they have a lot of lessons learned and the cross-collaboration that we could support by having that o... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Right. It shouldn't also be only on your shoulders either, as the Foundation, to do all the work. You wanna disperse that amongst the community and empower the people to do that. |
**Tracy Hinds:** You want them to own it, right. Exactly. That's the key. If people don't feel like they get to own things... No one's gonna raise their hand to say, "I've got this." They're gonna think somebody's handling it, and there's a lot that's happening in Node right now where that's the case, and that shouldn'... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** What kind of support then are you thinking about for not so much Node School in particular, but things like Node School or meetups across the world...? What kind of support can they look forward to? If they're listening to this now and they're not simply just a new user of Node or a potential contri... |
**Tracy Hinds:** I would say coordination of efforts and resources. A good example is you don't wanna give them water, you wanna lead them... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** ...to the well. |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah. A lot of events - and it's not just events that would like help, but a lot of them see the challenges around sponsorships or getting money, and they want money. But that doesn't actually sustain their project or their organization. So having folks who would like to offer advice, or having a repo ... |
\[35:54\] I saw that with Node School early on, how much the organizers helped one another with that. I mean, I was one of them, and that helped us all rise in our local groups, and really build communities there. But we're seeing new rounds of support needed, such as... Maybe one of those orgs wants to establish gover... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** So they come to you for advice on how to set up things...? |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah, they come for advice because they didn't know how to do that before. Or just even helping them organize a little bit... Having meetings on a regular cadence, or having some sort of accountability to a larger group where they're reporting in may also drive them a little bit to help out more just i... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Have you ever considered things like localized community managers where you almost have - I don't wanna use military terms, but like lieutenants out there in the field so to speak, that are doing the day-to-day, they're in the trenches, they're in the fight, they care about the local community, they... |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah, that's a really great idea. I would say that some meetup organizers or Node School organizers, they tend to take on that role informally. It's someone that just kicks butt locally, and they maybe have their hands in a couple different pots, so they're able to kind of see a slightly larger picture... |
Having folks that are on the ground like that gives you a less myopic perspective, I think; it allows you to know what's going on in an area and not just a user group. Sometimes those user groups are big enough, and that will be a pretty representative sentiment if something's really good or not good, but that's a real... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** What's Node Live? |
**Tracy Hinds:** Node Live was initially tagged as a mini-conference; it was a one-day event... It could be on a weekend, all day, or it could be in an evening for a pretty long evening. It's essentially a fancy meetup that's bringing in people from potentially other areas, and also uplifting maybe a speaker who is the... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Or too hard to travel to the U.S., if it's from abroad... |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** I was talking to Thomas Watson, he said he got in... |
**Tracy Hinds:** Oh my gosh, he had the hardest time. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah, he had some troubles with his travels and he had to flip his time clock, basically. So I sympathize with that, having to be jet-lagged. |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah. So those sorts of visits were really awesome, because it also opened us. Mikeal Rogers and I, we try and meet new people all the time, we have tons of emails and DMs and conversations on GitHub, and it's so not enough; those networks are still walled, in some ways. |
Beijing was an especially powerful visit for finding out how was behind the Great Firewall. We knew we were gonna run into some surprises, we just didn't know how rich that community would be, and we have no connection to it. So that's... They're running their own npm. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** \[40:01\] It's the language barrier and it's also the actual firewall barrier, so you get two huge hurdles to tackle when it comes to opening the doors to be more inclusive to China. |
**Tracy Hinds:** Right. So that's something that we could really work on. I was thinking the idea would be sort of like this research effort - because it takes a lot of work to build those networks. Being in person is a much more natural way to do so, even if there's a language barrier. But it's pretty cost-prohibitive... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, you can't Google Hangouts with them either. |
**Tracy Hinds:** Yeah, exactly. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** I'm not sure if Citrix is blessed or not, but Google is not. |
**Tracy Hinds:** I think they use Skype... I think I used Skype when I was having a meeting. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, it's a Microsoft thing, so it's probably okay. |
**Tracy Hinds:** I was also calling Microsoft people, so that might have been part of it. \[laughs\] I was a part of their campus in Beijing. But yeah, we need the power of saying, "I'm part of the Node Foundation/Node Project." |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Some clout. |
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